Jump to content
Mark Tillman

Section Numbers On A Topo Map When Using The Blm's Lr2000 Database.

Recommended Posts

In researching active/closed mining claims using the BLM's LR2000 database, I've been using National Geographic's Topo mapping software to find the township, range and section number. My problem is trying to determine the correct section number at the 7.5 min scale on my map. While the section number is oftentimes  visible, how do I  handle areas of the map that don't give a section number? Finally, is there a convienient source for determining the correct meridian for an area? Here in western AZ, we have the Gila-Salt River meridian but I'm interested in looking at some areas west of here  and I'm not sure if they would still be under the same meridian? Thanks

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The BLM has a map of the land each of the Meridians cover. Its available on the internet and we published part of it in the ICMJ magazine a couple months ago.

 

Areas where there are no sections are more difficult. They are typically projected from nearby townships, but can be hard to determine. Try looking at the USGS 1 to 100,000 maps. They often have projected sections shown on them for places the 7.5 minute maps do not.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Thanks for the suggestions Chris, Geowizard although I didn't  have any luck getting the PLSS layer to work when I tried it. It was my impression that the Geocommunicator application was not currently available at the 1:24000 scale level. Anyone else have any success with that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This link will take you to a downloadable PLSS file that you open in Google Earth.

http://www.geocommunicator.gov/ARCGIS/REST/services/PLSS/MapServer

 

Near the top of the page, click on the "Google Earth" link.

Save that file to your computer and open it in GE.

 

 

Now all you have to do is check/un-check,  the PLSS box and you will always know what TSR you're looking at.

 

There is also a similar file that shows all BLM lands in GE. If your interested, I will go find where I got that from.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is my first post here and I'm excited to have found the forum.  I was looking in my first topo map from 1981 from AZ and noticed that only about 3/4 of it had section / township range info, and it was the 1/4 of it that didn't that I was interested in.  I got turned onto Geocoder from another forum which if I know the Township info will deliver coords, but needs to be entered in a specific script to get results.  This even gives coords of lots.  I've found this to be more accurate than putting the tac on the map for the Geocommunicator maps.

 

GEOCODER

========

http://www.geocommunicator.gov/TownshipGeocoder/ and use the lat long section.  It gets entered exactly in this format:

 

AZ,14,8,0,N,4,0,W,8,NWSE,0

 

So, this is:

 

8N 4W Section 8 North West Quarter Quarter of South East Quarter. 

 

Zeros are placeholders for no data, so if you wanted to know the whole boundary for the mile by mile area, enter 0 where there NWSE.  It will even give Lat Longs for lots. The State of Arizona (AZ) Salt River Basin (14) Township 8 Subdivision 0 North Range 4 Subdivision 0 West Section 6 North West quarter / quarter of the Southeast Quarter Section

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Always remember -some don't have numbers as leftovers. There are huge area leftovers from remapping technologies advances. Helena here in kalif a perfect example. Irregular sections,leftovers and all sorts a fun stuff to keep ya on your toes. John

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A lot of the Public Land Survey is irregular. Particularly in the Sierra, it's rare to find a square one mile section there. Most of the California central valley and Southern California has never been surveyed for the PLSS.

 

You can and should extrapolate those Townships and Sections when making a claim in an unsurveyed area so as to give the BLM a general reference for their files. Also locating by metes and bounds as well as the extrapolated PLSS will nail down your location. Federal Land Survey standards frown on corners that are located further than two miles from a permanent monument or feature so be careful about extending the survey any further than necessary to come up with a quarter section description for the BLM files.

 

The extrapolated PLSS does not have brass markers so be careful about distinguishing between the Public Land Survey System and marked mineral survey corners. We see a lot of people assuming they have found a Survey corner because the Topo map has a "BM". It's fine to use a registered mineral survey to locate by because by law they are incorporated into the Public Land Survey but to mistake those survey markers for corner sections will put your paper location at odds with the physical location. You can also use registered surveys for Federal patents and Townsite grants to locate by - they are both incorporated into the Public Land Survey.

 

As for claims location be careful about using BLM plats or County plats. They can be used when defining a location but neither one of them fit the legal requirement to locate claims by the Public Land Survey or Metes and Bounds. The same goes for locating a claim in reference to another existing claim - other claims go away or change and so does the assessors tax map and the BLM plats. Those can be used in addition to the PLSS or Metes and Bounds but are not a valid locator by themselves.

 

You can use any reasonable method to clarify the location of a claim including reference to other surveys, gps, lat/lon, narrative descriptions, and natural permanent objects but the legal description of the claim must be by either the Public Land Survey or Metes and Bounds - or both.

 

Just practical knowledge, experience and study. Not to be taken as legal advice...  :)

 

Barry

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'll never forget flying in a helicopter lookn' for mining sites in the Trinity Alps. On the exact tippy top of the most highest peak on a miniscule 30+ foot spire was a USGS bronze marker where some fella hung outta a chopper and pounded that marker in the tippy top. Larry our pilot lowered down real close so I could see the proof. Amazing,simply amazing as they could have utilized a witness marker but chose amazing EXACTATUDE in placement. As technology advances so does accuracy in locations marked on maps. Metes and bounds is the legal means of marking boundaries in these areas crazy mixed up hodgepodge sections. 660' form quartz pinnacle sw to gully end 1600' etc.etc. Still works-John

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×